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Giveth Governance Meeting #35

June 14th, 2018

Youtube Livestream -


Kay, Griff, Yalor, Luke, Kris, Adam, Bowen, Vojtech, Satya, RJ, Lorelei, Lindsay

dropped-in: XXX left-early: XXX


Griff - no distractions, intentions for quick meeting
Lorelei - no distractions, excited to talk about the loomio proposals
Kay - lots to talk about, hope its short, expect to go thru all
Yalor - same, keeping it on task, mainly want to talk about loomio budget proposal
Kris - no distractions
Adam - no distractions, looking fwd to interesting mtg, gettin up to speed
Lindsay - poor reception, is on her phone, here to support
RJ - no distractions, hoping for quick
Satya - bit distracted, might have to leave in 20 min, intend to get dates of aragon meetup
Vojtech - no distractions so let's make it quick!


Toggled-Off: Bowen, Luke


  • Point1: The Gov Campaign is out of money!
  • Point2: What donations do we accept and what do we do with those we decide to reject? - Vojtech - no proposal yet, just discussion so leave it on loomio for now, no need to discuss here
  • Point3: Reinventing 'Is it safe enough to try' - Satya - Didn't want to bring it to gov mtg yet, great discussion on loomio

Aragon meetup: we'll be there 4th-7th or 8th



Gov circle is out of funds! in the neg


Griff will make personal donation during migration campaign, for now going in the red (taking little loan from other circles). We maintain the current split of donations until the dapp has implemented the donate button and any overages the gov campaign has will be covered by my (Griff's) direct donation out of my personal funds during the migration process (When the multisig sends money to the Bridge-Vault, if the Gov Campaign is in red, I will send that exact amount of ether into the Bridge-Vault so that the other campaigns get exactly the amount they are supposed to get and the Gov Campaign will get 0.

Clarifying Questions

Kay - isn't this two proposals? isn't this about the budget question in general? theres 2 questions - why did gov run out? and should there be more transparency about budgets?
Griff - When we did the budget we expected to not do events anymore for a while, i have been paying Lindsay and Lorelei outside of budget b/c gov didn't have enough funds in gov campaign, so yes the transparency is tied to gov running out.


Yalor - had some time to think about this, and how it will work in the future. we have this donation split now... have been talking about future plans, 1,2, and 4 go reg split, 3 and 5 go straight to dev
Kris - likes yalor and vojtech's proposal b/c griff shouldn't be spending his own funds this way, appreciate Kay's remark, but that is probably another proposal. For transparency and correctness it makes sense that giveth would pay for giveth work
RJ - everybody goes to these meetups, so it makes sense that the cost is split more amongst the campaigns
Lorelei - I agree there is some tension around transparency around griff funding these things, i think the proposal at hand is a good idea
Adam - good to make a roadmap for future down the line
Lindsay - valid points, support the proposal, lets use it as an opportunity to plan for the future. immediate response is support
Satya - serious issue that a circle is running out of money. we should learn from this. i don't like this solution very much. its aragon grant for dapp development, why should we use this money to pay our bills? I'm not super excited about this, but yes the grant can be used in any way. Gov circle is doing a lot for all of us, the events are very expensive and do so much for all of us. Maybe don't spend money that we don't have.
Vojtech - reacting a bit to satya too. in getting aragon grant, its clearly stated in the grant proposal that money will be split across the circles. We allocated in each circle money for meetups but so far haven't used them. To stay on the original proposal, sure, gov can get a loan from griff. Griff gives 30 ETH in the campaign once it's created and create a milestone for a refund.
Kay - i don't believe in the idea of circle leads any more, i dont' think we're doing a good job of that, we should maybe rotate. its a bit crazy that at the point the budget has run out that's when we find out... not earlier. We could've made a solution before this happened. I'd like to have a reality check come from this, about circle leads and about how we allocate to each circle, its hard to see how much each circle has and how they have been managing their funds. I'm not sure the current percentage breakdown is working. To come back to the proposal, i will abstain but will go with majority

Amend and Clarify

I'm not sure I fully understood Yalor and Vojtech's plan. I'm generally the main donor of Giveth, in many ways (don't really take pay for my work). Maybe it's difficult to separate Griff the Gov Lead and Griff the donor, but if you look at me as the latter maybe it makes more sense that i just fund this with my donation out of pocket. During migration a lot of this will disappear, reward dao will prob be its own campaign, events have piled extra cost beyond expected in january. Adding bowen and kay... Things change. And big changes are coming with getting the dapp out so I'd prefer a temporary solution (the loan) rather than reassessing the whole budget right now, that would be a lot of work. I'm going to stick with the same original proposal that if gov is in the red, I will donate.


Yalor - until the proposal Vojtech and I brought is fully examined, let's not make this discussion.
Griff - is it not safe enough to try? where is the damage to giveth in moving fwd?
Y - we're moving in a bad direction, obfuscating how funds are being spent, it'll cause issues
griff will amend to say: Unless a better proposal comes up, we will move fwd with this one. Right now, Gov is negative and theres no way to donate directly to gov campaign, so there's no way to pay people out, and this week is stopped. If we don't go fwd with my loan proposal we will have to propose some sort of allowance for these people who are expecting payments.
Vojtech - right now you CAN donate straight to the gov circle, on the sheet. that could be a solution.
Griff - that isss a solution, but it opens up a can of worms because we had an agreement that until the dapp is working we will use the split. We need to satisfy the initial tension which is right now it's in the red.
Yalor - i don't wanna freeze payments obvi, i agree, i won't block it, i'll agree to let it pass for now, we need to have a longer convo in the future about circle lead responsibility


Passed, more discussion offline


Lengthy discussion spawned from immediate problem, brought up lots of passionate issues, great launching point for more discussion. Loomio time!


Kris - looking forward to loomio, happy i'm not the only one who blocked the proposal ;P
Yalor - thanks for hearing me out, working together
Lindsay - miss you all, nice to hear you out
Vojtech - thanks for discussion, clearly shows there is a lack of transparency and decisions being made according to agreements, its shows its something we should work on but for now its fine we found a solution!
RJ - too quiet!
Adam - interesting to hear the process
Luke - cool to watch for my first mtg
Kay - get ya hooked on gov mtgs like netflix! ooh the drama is edgy. we have a system in place so this is a good starting point to explore more these concepts in depth. i like what vojtech said about lack of transparency.

End of meeting